Then, even more recently, I saw a link to a blog posted by someone: the title of the blog actually stated that they were against Dispensationalism. I eventually came to find that they were post-milleniallists, which started to make sense, and I was asked by a couple of people to respond to the blog post in question. This is that response: I hope you can at least learn something of my stance, even if I'm not able to change your doctrinal stance.
Showing posts with label dispensations. Show all posts
Showing posts with label dispensations. Show all posts
Monday, April 26, 2010
A Response to Anti-Dispensationalism
I know of few people that describe themselves as "anti-dispensationalists." Many I know would distance themselves from Dispensationalism, calling it "Ruckmanism," of all things, but until recently I had heard of very few people that would actually believe that Dispensational theology is unbiblical. For instance, the church I grew up in did not teach what I call Rightly Dividing, that God dealt with different people differently at different times in history: i.e. Adam was given different commands than Noah who was given different commands than Abraham, etc. Israel was unquestionably required to keep the WORKS of the Law: yes they were a picture of Christ, but they had absolutely no clue about that! Also, Jesus taught meekness and non-violence, but to Jews only, while Paul taught forbearance as much as possible and called people fools, directly contrary to Christ's command in Matthew 5:22.
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Wednesday, September 10, 2008
Romans Road vs. Straight and Narrow
Occasionally someone shows up on the forum from whence I was last banned and starts arguing Salvation from Matthew or Hebrews or even the OT. It's hilarious, to be honest. They fall all over themselves, arguing Scriptures and trying to explain things away, while the heretic runs roughshod over them and makes them look like fools. Don't get me wrong, there are several nice, Godly people there, and I like several of them, but 98% of the people there can't answer a man like that.
The current fiasco is a "WWJD" type of guy, the kind that doesn't pay attention to mail addresses (see my earlier posts on that). He likes Jesus' message. Who doesn't? Blessed are the poor in spirit, blessed are the peacemakers, etc. His message, while hard, is nice for the most part. And it's Jesus, so we should obey Him, right?
THREE times, Paul tells the CHURCH to follow him. Yes, the final object is Christ, because Paul followed Christ, but he commanded the Church to follow HIM three times. That's an indisputable fact, unless you like to argue with the Bible (not a smart thing to do).
So let's back up a little. Why Paul and not Jesus? Well, who was Jesus speaking to? Who did Jesus preach to? Most importantly, who did Jesus NOT preach to? Remember the Cyro-phonecian woman? Jesus called her a DOG! He said that it's not right to give the childrens' bread unto DOGS!! How's that for racial equality? Jesus didn't go to the Gentiles: He didn't preach to them, He didn't waste time on their ailments, He didn't try to convert them. He said that He was sent not but to the lost sheep of the house of ISRAEL!
Who was Paul sent to? Who did he preach and write to? God said that Paul was to be a witness to the Gentiles. He was the Apostle to the Gentiles, and also the messenger to the Church (9 books addressed to churches?).
So, are you going to take a Jewish gospel, from a Jewish preacher, to a Jewish nation, and believe that, when God Himself said that Paul was the preacher to the Gentiles, and in turn the church? So, Romans or the Sermon on the Mount? Chop off your hand or live peaceably as much as lieth in you? Endure to the end or He'll keep us from falling?
Your choice. God, however, is right and true, and His word never faileth.
The current fiasco is a "WWJD" type of guy, the kind that doesn't pay attention to mail addresses (see my earlier posts on that). He likes Jesus' message. Who doesn't? Blessed are the poor in spirit, blessed are the peacemakers, etc. His message, while hard, is nice for the most part. And it's Jesus, so we should obey Him, right?
I Corinthians 4:16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.
I Corinthians 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.
Philippians 3:17 Brethren, be followers together of me,
THREE times, Paul tells the CHURCH to follow him. Yes, the final object is Christ, because Paul followed Christ, but he commanded the Church to follow HIM three times. That's an indisputable fact, unless you like to argue with the Bible (not a smart thing to do).
So let's back up a little. Why Paul and not Jesus? Well, who was Jesus speaking to? Who did Jesus preach to? Most importantly, who did Jesus NOT preach to? Remember the Cyro-phonecian woman? Jesus called her a DOG! He said that it's not right to give the childrens' bread unto DOGS!! How's that for racial equality? Jesus didn't go to the Gentiles: He didn't preach to them, He didn't waste time on their ailments, He didn't try to convert them. He said that He was sent not but to the lost sheep of the house of ISRAEL!
Who was Paul sent to? Who did he preach and write to? God said that Paul was to be a witness to the Gentiles. He was the Apostle to the Gentiles, and also the messenger to the Church (9 books addressed to churches?).
So, are you going to take a Jewish gospel, from a Jewish preacher, to a Jewish nation, and believe that, when God Himself said that Paul was the preacher to the Gentiles, and in turn the church? So, Romans or the Sermon on the Mount? Chop off your hand or live peaceably as much as lieth in you? Endure to the end or He'll keep us from falling?
Your choice. God, however, is right and true, and His word never faileth.
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Sunday, August 24, 2008
Basic Grammar...continued
Ok, so let's see how far I can get with this.
Samer is a guy I've known for quite a while. I don't mean to smear him, though I probably could rather easily, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to be a little blunt about him. He doesn't like me. He finds every possible excuse that he can to disagree with me. And now he's deleted a thread with my previous article on it. AFTER he found out that the owner of the site had ok'd the post. If that's not abusing one's power, then I don't know what is!!
So every time I bring up Biblical Dispensationalism, he immediately quotes the whole of Romans 4 and expects all the Dispensationalists to drop dead on the spot. Strangely enough they don't, which I'm sure is a bit of a quandary to him. I'm going to try to clear up any questions that he may have about the issue here and now.
"is" denotes being, in the present. "The pizza IS cold" meaning the pizza currently is cold.
"was" denotes past tense, as in a past point in time. "The pizza was hot" meaning the pizza at one point was hot, and by implication is no longer hot.
The funny thing about these passages is that they're quoting an Old Testament verse. Wanna' see what it is?
So? Ok, so Paul misquoted the Bible to make a point. Your problem? See, the Bible doesn't have to make sense to you. The authors, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, didn't have to wait for your opinion to write what they did. They just did it and God blessed it. No, that missing word isn't a scribal error. It's missing on purpose.
So, what have we learned from this? That God, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit on men, can write what He wants to, to make what points He wants to, and it doesn't matter a bit what you or anyone else thinks about it. Ok, hopefully that's clear enough.
Next point: debunking the myth that Romans 4 proves that everyone got saved by repenting of their sins and trusting Christ. Sorry, but that in and of itself is laughable! If the DISCIPLES didn't know that Jesus was going to rise again, then how on God's green earth could DAVID have known? Or anyone before the actual resurrection?? Come on now, use that brain God benevolently placed within your skull!
See, the simple explanation is that Paul is writing to one group of people, namely the Church, of which you and I are a part, and James is writing to someone else, or a group of someone elses. Which theory makes sense, since Paul addresses all of the letters with "To the church which is at (insert city here)" and James starts his epistle with "To the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad." See, when viewed from a literal, grammatical, logical perspective, the Bible makes complete and perfect sense.
It just doesn't agree with you.
Samer is a guy I've known for quite a while. I don't mean to smear him, though I probably could rather easily, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to be a little blunt about him. He doesn't like me. He finds every possible excuse that he can to disagree with me. And now he's deleted a thread with my previous article on it. AFTER he found out that the owner of the site had ok'd the post. If that's not abusing one's power, then I don't know what is!!
So every time I bring up Biblical Dispensationalism, he immediately quotes the whole of Romans 4 and expects all the Dispensationalists to drop dead on the spot. Strangely enough they don't, which I'm sure is a bit of a quandary to him. I'm going to try to clear up any questions that he may have about the issue here and now.
"is" denotes being, in the present. "The pizza IS cold" meaning the pizza currently is cold.
"was" denotes past tense, as in a past point in time. "The pizza was hot" meaning the pizza at one point was hot, and by implication is no longer hot.
Rom. 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.Ok, good verse. Now let's see what it says. "...is the reward not reckoned of grace...." Notice the tense? That's an important word: "Tense."
tense 2 |tɛns| |tɛns|Ok, so a tense denotes in which time or times a certain occurrence...occurs. Simple enough, right? Ok so I'm going to throw a few things out here and see what happens.
noun Grammar
a set of forms taken by a verb to indicate the time (and sometimes also the continuance or completeness) of the action in relation to the time of the utterance : the past tense
Rom. 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.Always watch those slippery tenses. Is, are, etc. are rather complicated unless you pay close attention. Notice that Paul in Romans 4 is making a comparison, using Old Testament occurrences and making them fit the doctrine that he is teaching right now. Let's see something else that gets changed to fit what the author needs it to say!
Rom. 4:14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:
Rom. 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.Good verses! These verses, or at least the first two, show that we are to live by the faith of Christ, which faith is really the gift of Ephesians 2:8-9, if you pay attention. The third verse is applicable to the HEBREWS in the Tribulation (does His soul really have no pleasure in you if you draw back??) and therefore is not DOCTRINALLY applicable to us.
Gal. 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Heb. 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
The funny thing about these passages is that they're quoting an Old Testament verse. Wanna' see what it is?
Hab. 2:4 Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.Cool! See what a little Bible study...um, wait a second...reread that verse. Another time. Once more for good measure. Look at the word ALL THREE of the NT verses leave out!! The OT passage that's being quoted says that a just man lives by HIS faith, speaking of his own, while the NT verses say that a just man shall live by CHRIST'S faith!! Rather interesting predicament, eh? PAUL JUST MISQUOTED THE BIBLE!!!
So? Ok, so Paul misquoted the Bible to make a point. Your problem? See, the Bible doesn't have to make sense to you. The authors, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, didn't have to wait for your opinion to write what they did. They just did it and God blessed it. No, that missing word isn't a scribal error. It's missing on purpose.
So, what have we learned from this? That God, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit on men, can write what He wants to, to make what points He wants to, and it doesn't matter a bit what you or anyone else thinks about it. Ok, hopefully that's clear enough.
Next point: debunking the myth that Romans 4 proves that everyone got saved by repenting of their sins and trusting Christ. Sorry, but that in and of itself is laughable! If the DISCIPLES didn't know that Jesus was going to rise again, then how on God's green earth could DAVID have known? Or anyone before the actual resurrection?? Come on now, use that brain God benevolently placed within your skull!
Rom. 4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.Quick question: does this passage say that Abraham was not justified by works? Yes or no answer; it's really quite simple. In fact, if you pay attention, Paul's making a rather misleading question here. He asks if Abraham was justified by his works, and then instead of answering the question, he turns it around and talks about glorifying before God, when that wasn't even part of the original question! In fact, Paul just avoided answering his own question, because it would have totally messed up his point! Don't believe me? Well read the next verse.
Rom. 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?Everyone likes to try to do away with this little problem to their theology by making this "justification before man," but they don't realize that it's their theology at fault. Abraham WAS justified by his works. He was NOT sanctified by his works, but he WAS justified. That verse says so. So basically, Paul's premise in Romans 4:1 is correct, just misleading. He WAS justified by his works, but he does NOT have whereof to glory before God. See? Again, simple English grammar. An understanding of the difference between Sanctification and Justification helps too.
James 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
James 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
See, the simple explanation is that Paul is writing to one group of people, namely the Church, of which you and I are a part, and James is writing to someone else, or a group of someone elses. Which theory makes sense, since Paul addresses all of the letters with "To the church which is at (insert city here)" and James starts his epistle with "To the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad." See, when viewed from a literal, grammatical, logical perspective, the Bible makes complete and perfect sense.
It just doesn't agree with you.
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Friday, August 22, 2008
Repent and be baptized
The Bible is incredible; a cursory look through its pages reveals thousands of years of history, from the creation of the universe to the very end of the world. A more in-depth look reveals even more, a Righteous God who for some reason gives men a chance every time he disobeys His creator. However, it's when a person gets down and studies, as per the instructions of 2 Timothy 2:15, that we find how incredible the Bible truly is.
When we study the Bible, we see that God has always made a way for man to come to Him, but that way changes through Scripture. Before you write me off as a heretic, which most people will at just that, bear with me a bit and let's see what the Bible says.
It should be obvious that Noah found grace in God's eyes because of how he lived: just and perfect in his generations. All that means is that he lived in that manner to please God, and God gave him grace as a result of him trying to please the Lord. So, that's the reason that God chose Noah, a righteous man as the Bible calls him, to escape the judgment that God was going to bring on the earth. So what did Noah do to escape that judgment?
This can be followed all through the Bible: God dealing with people differently, but always providing Grace, because we humans are frail and imperfect, and without God's Grace we'd be hopeless. Whether it was the Law that the Israelites were required to keep, or Abraham's work of offering Isaac, God always provided a way through His Grace for man to be saved from his sin.
Now let's check out the New Testament. Jesus shows up, the promised Messiah, and starts preaching. But what does He preach? Let's see!
When you compare what John the Baptist and Jesus preached with what Paul and the Apostles preached consistently after Acts 15, you'll see a big difference. Jesus is preaching humility, piety and good works in the Sermon on the Mount, and John the Baptist is preaching repentance and baptism! Again, we see that God is dealing with someone, the Jews in this case, differently than He has dealt with other people before. Jesus said that He was sent not but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, and went so far as to call a gentile woman a DOG! That doesn't sound much like Romans 5:8 to me. Jesus went so far as to tell them not to enter into the way of the Gentiles! So obviously something is different right now from Acts 10:10-16 and the following chapter.
The next part gets tricky; not because the Bible is hard to understand, but because people like to twist It out of context to prove their own doctrines. "Acts" is simply a history book, recording the time after Christ's resurrection and subsequent ascension. At the beginning of the book of Acts, Jesus sends the disciples out to spread the Gospel. What Gospel had they been given? The Gospel of the Kingdom! Up until that point, Jesus had been preaching what has been corrupted into a social Gospel: "Do good" and "the meek shall inherit the earth," which while it isn't wrong, it's simply not what we find later on in Scripture. Let's look then at what Peter preached, under the leading of the Holy Spirit.
Ok, so we have a quandary here. We know that the Tribulation hasn't started yet, and won't for a while yet, but here's Peter preaching about the Tribulation in Acts chapter 2! So, is someone wrong here, or did something change? We'll skip a little bit; you can read it if you want to, but to save space I'm going to skip past it a little.
First, find Salvation in that chapter. Hint: you won't. Second, to whom is Peter talking? He's talking to Jews, who just recently crucified their Messiah. What time frame does Peter think he's in? The Tribulation.
Basically, Peter is preaching something that you will NEVER see preached again in that sense, as baptism being included with salvation doesn't show up after Acts 15. As far as they're aware of, they're about to head into the Tribulation after the imminent return of Jesus Christ. And there is NO MENTION of salvation in that chapter at all. Peter is preaching a national repentance because of the rejection of Christ. That's why he says to be baptized in the name of Jesus: it was a sign that they were following Jesus Christ, whom their nation had just rejected. These people were getting ready for the Antichrist, not Salvation!
There's always more issues that Campbellites bring up in response, but this covers the main one. Enjoy; I'll prepare for a second installment after I receive all the feedback from this.
God bless.
When we study the Bible, we see that God has always made a way for man to come to Him, but that way changes through Scripture. Before you write me off as a heretic, which most people will at just that, bear with me a bit and let's see what the Bible says.
Genesis 3:21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.God provided a covering for their sins, because that sin damned their souls to Hell. God is the only one that can cover or forgive the sins of human-kind. However, let's look at the next important person in the Bible: Noah.
Genesis 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.
9 ¶These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.
It should be obvious that Noah found grace in God's eyes because of how he lived: just and perfect in his generations. All that means is that he lived in that manner to please God, and God gave him grace as a result of him trying to please the Lord. So, that's the reason that God chose Noah, a righteous man as the Bible calls him, to escape the judgment that God was going to bring on the earth. So what did Noah do to escape that judgment?
Genesis 6:22 Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.He obeyed God and built the boat. He could have had all the faith in the world that God was going to save him and his family, but if he hadn't built the boat, then he would have died like everyone else. Yes he built the ark by faith, but without those works, he would have been deader 'n a bag of hammers. It was his obedience that saved him, simply his obedience to do what God had commanded him.
This can be followed all through the Bible: God dealing with people differently, but always providing Grace, because we humans are frail and imperfect, and without God's Grace we'd be hopeless. Whether it was the Law that the Israelites were required to keep, or Abraham's work of offering Isaac, God always provided a way through His Grace for man to be saved from his sin.
Now let's check out the New Testament. Jesus shows up, the promised Messiah, and starts preaching. But what does He preach? Let's see!
Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.
Matthew 9:35 And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people.
Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
Matthew 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
When you compare what John the Baptist and Jesus preached with what Paul and the Apostles preached consistently after Acts 15, you'll see a big difference. Jesus is preaching humility, piety and good works in the Sermon on the Mount, and John the Baptist is preaching repentance and baptism! Again, we see that God is dealing with someone, the Jews in this case, differently than He has dealt with other people before. Jesus said that He was sent not but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, and went so far as to call a gentile woman a DOG! That doesn't sound much like Romans 5:8 to me. Jesus went so far as to tell them not to enter into the way of the Gentiles! So obviously something is different right now from Acts 10:10-16 and the following chapter.
The next part gets tricky; not because the Bible is hard to understand, but because people like to twist It out of context to prove their own doctrines. "Acts" is simply a history book, recording the time after Christ's resurrection and subsequent ascension. At the beginning of the book of Acts, Jesus sends the disciples out to spread the Gospel. What Gospel had they been given? The Gospel of the Kingdom! Up until that point, Jesus had been preaching what has been corrupted into a social Gospel: "Do good" and "the meek shall inherit the earth," which while it isn't wrong, it's simply not what we find later on in Scripture. Let's look then at what Peter preached, under the leading of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 2:14 ¶But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judæa, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:The funny thing here is that Peter is preaching a passage from the book of Joel about the Tribulation! Peter, speaking under the direct leading of the Holy Spirit, is preaching about the last days! Don't believe me? Read Joel chapter 2.
15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Ok, so we have a quandary here. We know that the Tribulation hasn't started yet, and won't for a while yet, but here's Peter preaching about the Tribulation in Acts chapter 2! So, is someone wrong here, or did something change? We'll skip a little bit; you can read it if you want to, but to save space I'm going to skip past it a little.
Acts 2:32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.So the Jews to whom Peter was preaching got convicted! He just got finished talking about the crucifixion of their Messiah-remember they were sent to preach the Gospel of the Kingdom and preform miracles!-and now they're sorrowful for their actions as a nation! Now what does Peter say in response?
33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
35 Until I make thy foes thy footstool.
36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37 ¶Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.Now we seem to have a problem. Ephesians 2:8-9 says that salvation is a gift from God, and says nothing of being baptized. Titus 2:5 says that salvation isn't by works: it's by grace alone. All through Paul's epistles we see salvation taught as being by faith alone outside of any work, which would include baptism. So why is Peter preaching baptism with repentance??
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
First, find Salvation in that chapter. Hint: you won't. Second, to whom is Peter talking? He's talking to Jews, who just recently crucified their Messiah. What time frame does Peter think he's in? The Tribulation.
Basically, Peter is preaching something that you will NEVER see preached again in that sense, as baptism being included with salvation doesn't show up after Acts 15. As far as they're aware of, they're about to head into the Tribulation after the imminent return of Jesus Christ. And there is NO MENTION of salvation in that chapter at all. Peter is preaching a national repentance because of the rejection of Christ. That's why he says to be baptized in the name of Jesus: it was a sign that they were following Jesus Christ, whom their nation had just rejected. These people were getting ready for the Antichrist, not Salvation!
There's always more issues that Campbellites bring up in response, but this covers the main one. Enjoy; I'll prepare for a second installment after I receive all the feedback from this.
God bless.
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